Nationals Arm Race

Droopy passed along a great trivia question; what four players have hit 400+ homers and have 10 gold gloves.  (the question was spurred on by one of the four answers, one Andruw Jones, having just hit his 400th homer this season and joining this exclusive club).  (The other three answers are at the bottom of the post).

But, it got me to thinking.  Andruw Jones is only 33, has 400 homers, 10 gold gloves and should be towards the end of his prime as a ballplayer.  Instead he seems to have basically forgotten  how to hit at age 30 and is bouncing from team to team to try to regain his swing.  Certainly Andruw is not a HoFamer at this point in his career, but if he was able to turn it around and become relevant again, even for a couple of seasons, and achieve some milestone numbers he very well may be.   I think the epitaph of Jones’ career will read something like, incredibly accomplished early in his career but inexplicably washed up by age 30.  Steroids?  Falsified age? Anything is possible.

Here’s a couple other test cases for HoF worthiness:
1. Johnny Damon.  Currently sits at 2527 career hits at age 36 and still hits well enough that you’d have to think he has an ouside shot at 3000.  Is he a hall of famer

if he gets to 3000?  The only guys who have 3000 that are NOT in the hall are:

• Rose (ineligible)
• Biggio (will be soon)
• Palmeiro (Roids).

Bonds retired with2935 (roids).  Jeter will get 3000 but i think he’s HoF material no doubt.  Harold Baines another test case; 2866 hits but isn’t getting close to induction on the votes.

My vote: nope.  Not an impact player, also an accumulator of stats over a long career.  He’s actually a worse fielder and hitter than Baines.

2. Jim Thome.  Currently sitting at 578 homers career and almost a lock to get 600 at age 39 and producing pretty well this year.  A number of years getting

MVP consideration but never finishing top 3.  5-time all star.  Some fo the hall of fame standards stat measurements have him just over the cusp.  My “standard” is always the stardom or fear factor test.  When Thome comes up, are you scared?  Are you on the edge of your seat?  Would you (as a visiting fan) see his team coming to town and think about buying tickets so you could see him (like Pujols with St. Louis for example).

My vote: borderline yes.

3. Adam Dunn.  (for the sake of argument you have to project his career to what it probably ends up at).  I’ll project him, sitting at 346 now but on pace to end
this year at 360 , to end up with right around 600 homers for his career. Analysis: give him 40-40-38-35-30-30 for the next six seasons, taking him to age 36 and sitting at around 575 homers.  Even if you trend those numbers down a bit, he’s still sitting in the mid 500s at age 36, and Thome has hit hearly 100 homers after that age.  Hell, if Dunn stays healthy and doesn’t precipitously decline in power (like Ortiz), he has an outside shot at 700 homers.  Unbelievable.

But you look at his career “accomplishments” and there’s NOTHING there.  To date he has made ONE all star team, finished 4th in ROY voting and in only two seasons
has even had an MVP vote, let alone come close to winning.  If Dunn reaches 600 homers is he a hall of famer?

My vote: nope.

There’s other great test cases out there (David Ortiz, Carlos Delgado, Jim Edmonds or Paul Konerko) with it comes to looking at “home run accumulations” for a career.  Perhaps another time.

ps: Trivia Answer: Andruw Jones, Ken Griffey Jr, Willie Mays and Mike Schmidt.  Al Kaline had 10 gold gloves but exactly 399 career homers.  Barry Bonds only managed 8 gold gloves before turning into a hulking left fielder on or about the same time he found steroids in 1999.

I don’t always necessarily agree with Chris Needham, who runs the Capitol Punishment blog and can be, well, “acerbic” at times with issues about the Nationals franchise.

But on this issue I kinda agree.  The Nats are honoring Andre Dawson tonight as a cherished former member of the franchise.  Which I think is fine.

But our history as a city hosting baseball goes beyond the Expos.  We claim Frank Howard and remember his great homers in RFK (despite the fact that they moved to Texas).  We remember Walter Johnson as probably the greatest player in our history (despite that version of the team now playing in Minnesota).

What do you guys think?  I thought about it from a football perspective and used a couple of recent relocations:
– Do Baltimore fans claim old Baltimore Colts as part their history, or the Cleveland Browns?  Maybe not the greatest example since Cleveland immediately got their team back via an expansion gift to the city.
– Do St. Louis fans remember the old St. Louis Cardinals and claim them?

I dunno.  I’ve read complaints from former Expos fans that the Washington ownership has almost systematically tried to forget that this team came from Montreal.  And I guess for good reason; the franchise was so  undersupported and badly run that they were closer to contracting it than giving it to DC.

But for me, DC baseball means the team playing here at the time.  We all know why the first two iterations of the Washington Senators moved away (primarily that the city just couldn’t support a team).  But this team is here to stay.

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Post trade deadline, Jayson Stark was quoted somewhere (can’t find the link) that the White Sox offered up both Daniel Hudson and catcher prospect Tyler Flowers for Dunn.  If that is indeed true, I can’t quite understand why the Nats didn’t pull the trigger.

I think perhaps the Nats hard line was a MLB-ready bat.  Hudson seems to be in the same place (or a bit better) as our Jordan Zimmermann right now; cleaned up at AA, and has impressed so far in MLB.  #2 starter prospect.  We already got a catcher prospect in Ramos (for Capps) but you can never have enough catching…

Honestly, everything i’ve read about Rizzo and Dunn this trading season was along the lines of “teams are calling us and making offers; we’re not calling them to
offer up Dunn.”  I really think teh Nats want to resign the guy.  Yeah he’ll be expensive but look at his production.

In the NL right now, here’s where Dunn is ranked in various categories:
2nd in slugging
3rd in OPS
10th in runs scored
2nd in total bases
6th in doubles
1st in homers
1st in extra base hits
3rd in RBI
3rd in Adjusted OPS+ (my favorite all-encompasing stat).  Currently at 153, Behind Votto and Pujols
and, yes 2nd in Ks.

You just have to resign a guy like this.  Youare not going to find a slugging talent like this on the FA market these days.  I mean, the best comparison seems to be someone like Fielder and he’ll be looking for a $100M contract.

Coincidentally.  here’s where Zimmermann is on all these lists as well:
10th in NL-wide war (5th among hitters)
11th in batting average
6th in OBP
8th in slugging
5th in OPS
10th in runs
4th in adjusted OPS+ at 147, just behind Dunn.

I mean, basically they’re saying that 2 of the 4 best overall hitters in the NL are hitting right next to each other in the heart of the Washington lineup.  I’ll put our 3-4-5 hitters up there against anyone in the league right now.  Milwaukee’s Braun-Fielder-Hart is pretty good.  Philly’s Utley-Howard-Werth should be up there in normal circumstances.  Same with the dodgers (a healthy Ramirez-Kemp-Ethier combo).

Speaking of the dodgers; man the nats (well, Dunn) got to Kershaw last night.  6 rbi and 2 homers will make for a nice week, let alone a nice first couple of at bats.

Sign him; he’s the key to the middle of the order of this team for the next 4 years, by which time we should be competing for the playoffs.

You have to like this move that Rizzo pulled off.

He turned a guy who was flat out released by Pittsburgh last year into the #2 prospect in Minnesota’s system (Wilson Ramos, a major-league ready catcher
from a defensive standpoint and probably Pudge’s understudy in a few weeks) plus a lefty reliever with staggering K/9 ratios the last two seasons (but not
so much this season, where he’s struggled a bit in high-A).
I love this move.  Capps did great for us undoubtedly and some will say that he is the reason our bullpen has stabilized this year versus last, but reality is:

• – a closer is an absolute luxury on a last place team
• – a closer can be great one year (Capps in 2010) but awful the next (Capps in 2009) and you have to sell high.
• – Saves are overrated and even mediocre bullpen guys can serve as the “closer” for a team that’s not in a pennant race.
• – The nats have a couple of very lively arms in the bullpen now that can immediately step up and open the door for the next reliever to come up (Severino?) to work towards the future.  As a last place team, that HAS to be the priority.

Now, here’s an interesting question.  Why did we get yet another upper-end catching prospect?  Right now the catching situation for the Nats looks like this:

• – Pudge; coming back to reality after a great start, signed through 2011
• – Nieves; classic good D no hit guy who is hitting .187/.223/.252 in 134 plate appearances this year and is just killing the team when he spells Pudge.  Great guy; but he’s probably getting his release inside the next couple weeks.
• – Norris: Nats #1 prospect in the minors right now; struggling after having hamate bone surgery (same surgery Zimmerman had a few years back) in high-A.  He tore up low-A and short-A though so he’ll get it back.  Question remains about him though; does he stay at Catcher?
• – Flores; another setback reporeted recently. at this point in his “recovery” he’s throwing from 90 feet and hitting off a tee.  Which is exactly what he was doing in March.  Despite everything that we expected from this kid, you almost have to write him off as a complete injury loss at this point.
• – Harper.  Catching prospect but he’ll be far faster the majors as a right fielder (which we have a need for anyway).  Boras wants him out of the catching position because it will mean more money and longer career (and thus more commissions).

thoughts?

1. The Haren trade was highway robbery by the Angels.  I know Haren’s numbers aren’t great but to get a guy who nearly finished last season with a 1.000 whip and got Cy Young votes for a #5 starter and some random prospects is crazy.

2. Stark is reporting a possible 3-team deal;

• White Sox get Adam Dunn
• Nationals get Edwin Jackson
• Arizona gets prospects (from both teams potentially)

If the nats do this I will scream.  There is no way in hell Dunn is worth *just* Edwin Jackson.  Especially not the way he’s pitching right now, in a big ole pitchers park in Arizona.

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Mike Morse.  2-3 with two homers last night in the pitcher friendly confines of Milwakuee.  Raises his season slash line figures to .338/.386/.636.  That’s a 1.022 ops and a 170 ops+ figure (by way of comparison, Votto is currently leading the NL in ops with 1.003).

He has 6 homers in 38 games, projecting to about 25 in a 150 game season.  He makes a ton of contact (15 ks in those same 38 games, projecting to only 60 or so in a full season).

I don’t get it.  We have a struggling center fielder/leadoff hitter in Morgan, and right next to him a surprising Bernadina character who has speed and a bit of power and could lead off/play centerfield.  Why aren’t we going Willingham-Bernadina-Morse in the outfield?  Lineup would be:

1. Bernadina
2. Guzman
3. Zimmerman
4. Dunn
5. Willingham
6. Morse
7. Desmond
8. Pudge
9. pitcher

That would give us ops+ guys over 100 in 3-4-5-6 spots, would give Willingham some protection, and would put a better producing guy at the top of the lineup.

Read through Stark’s espn chat yesterday and he took some Dunn trade questions.

Basically he says that the word on the street is that Dunn wants to stay but also wants a 4 year guaranteed contract.  He’s also hearing that the Nats have a “higher than
average” opinion of themselves and want to keep their 3-4-5 hitters in tact because we have so many arms coming back.  This agrees with Kasten’s recent comments that we’re “closer than you would think.”  And its hard to argue.  We’re puttering along with 3 guys in the rotation who would other wise be in AAA (Stammen, Atilano, Martin).
We never intended Livan to be our season savior; he was always meant to be a placeholder until Strasburg and Wang got healthy.

Now we’re looking at a situation by late august where we have way too many guys for the roatation.  Here’s a quick rundown on our former MLB arms:

• – Chico has two 7ip 0er performances in a row and (probably) makes a spot start sunday.
• – Detwiler is ready to come up (7 starts in the minors) and has been pitching well.
• – Olsen is on his 4th rehab start and might need a few more.
• – Marquis has 3 rehab starts but hasn’t looked great.  He says he feels good though. But post injury you have to think he is an option.
• – Zimmermann has pitched 13 scoreless innings with zero walks and 13 ks in high-A so far; you figure he has about 3 more starts before they have to make a decision on him too.
• – Wang looks like wasted money so far, but may be a bargain next year if he’s healthy at a cost controleld arbitration figure next year.
• – Lannan now has 6 starts in AA trying to “find” his sinker and so far he looks unsuccessful.  I hate to say it but Lannan may be completely forced out of the Nats starting picture.
• – and don’t forget new cuban signing Yuneski Maya, who most scouting reports say is MLB ready at 28.  Though, he apparently hasn’t pitched since last fall so hey may not get to the majors this year and will pitch in various minor leagues until sept.

The problem is that most of these guys are on rehab assignments.  Those can only last for 30 days (or about 6 starts).  Detwiler technically was activated and optioned (burning another option year for him, so now unless they get a medical waiver for a 4th option he has to pass through waivers to go back to the minors from here out; thanks Bowden for that 2007 callup!).

I guess the point is; a ton of pitching talent lays awaiting.  Maybe the Nats lick their wounds on this season, stand pat, resign Dunn to 3yrs $42M with a club option for the 4th that possibly vests with certain productivity in year three and focus on filling the hitting holes we’ll have in free agency.  And next year’s rotational competition looks tough.

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1. Atilano.  In 16 starts he’s now 6-7, 5.15 era, 1.49 whip.  The team is 6-10 in his starts. More telling: in 5 of his 16 starts now he’s given up as many earned runs as innings pitched.  That’s just not acceptable.  I realize there’s nobody really better (Chico?  Martis?) until one of Detwiler/Wang/Zimmermann/Marquis/Olsen recovers from injury but man.  Its brutal.

2. Leake.  Like this kid.  He looks a lot like Bronson Arroyo, even down to the stupid haircut. A ton of movement with a mlb-average fastball and decent control.  I know everyone is talking about the St. Louis rookie pitcher Garcia  but i like this guy.  Taken 2 picks before Storen; imagine if he had fallen to us at the #10 spot lastyear?

3. At what point in the season do we do what is obviously right for the team and stick Bernadina in center and Morse in right?  Morse is hitting .324/.375/.554 with 4 homers in 80 plate appearances.  That’s almost a 30 homer clip extrapolated out to a full season.  Have we found our right field solution by accident?  Bernadina is doing great; he has some power, hits for average, has some decent speed (7 sbs).  Maybe we stick him in center.  Morgan has easily the worst OPS+ on the team right now and has a .315 on base percentage at leadoff.  Unacceptable.  Even Guzman, he of the 4 walks in 600 plate appearances last season, has a better OBP this year.  And nearly as many walks as Morgan!

Nats currently on track for 69-93 season and the 7th overall pick.  And if we succumb to pressure and trade Dunn or Willingham or both, we may not score the rest of the season…

Welcome to nationalsarmrace.com!

Not that the moribund Washington Nationals necessarily needed another blog, but I couldn’t resist.

Ever since the Nats rolled into town in 2005, I’ve developed an unhealthy obsession with the team, and more interestingly its rotation, bullpen, farm system and player development.  Over the past couple of years specifically, I’ve begun to track the pitchers (mostly the rotations) of our various farm systems and take interest in the development of pitching talent as it rises through the ranks.  Hence the name of the blog “Nationals Arms Race.”  I do periodically write for Brian Oliver and his standard-bearing natsfarm.com blog and do not wish to replicate what he does in the least.  But periodically i do like to talk about the major league rotation instead of the prospects and never felt comfortable with those topics on a prospect-centric blog.

I hope to have a pitching-focused blog that talks about the current Nats MLB rotation, the 40-man spotholders, prospects and who may be coming up next month or next year.  I’ll talk about pitching in general, some observations and some advanced stats.  I will post random musings about the Nationals in general and hope that my close friends with whom I regularly converse about baseball will chime in and offer their 2 cents about their own favorite teams (generally, the Phillies, Yankees and Dodgers).  I’ll talk about pitchers around the majors and baseball in general here and there.

I hope you find my writing interesting and topical.  You can always unsubscribe I suppose 🙂

Thanks, todd